Wow... Republicans Really ARE Scum!

[GreNME]

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles...n_as_extensive/ (http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2004/01/22/infiltration_of_files_seen_as_exten sive/)

Not only have Republicans been actively spying on Democrats, but they've been snatching documents that were meant to be read by Democratic party members who had authorization. If effect, they were stealing, though with the help of a little legalese and fancy-talk, they are claiming that the blame falls squarely on the shoulders of the Democrats they were stealing from, and that they were not doing anything they weren't supposed to.

Well... except that they weren't supposed to be reading those documents, or leaking them to the media.

And it's not stealing exactly how? Basically, according to them, since the Republican members who were doing the filching were able to bypass known parameters of their use of the server storing the information, they were within their rights to make use of the documents that were not theirs. That is like saying that if I find that my bank that has no protection on their network, I am not breaking the law if I slide on in there and add some zeros to my account. Or even better, take zeros from someone's account who I don't like and add them to my own.

How can anyone justify this kind of behavior? How is this more justifiable than when a certain President's staff was sneaking into the offices of the other party, and stealing copies of their files? How is this any more acceptable?

[Lalito]

It was the Republicans who did it. Duh. Somehow I get the impression that this would be a national security matter if the positions were reversed.

[GreNME]

It's not quite that easy to say, Eddie. Plain and simple, this shouldn't have happened, and the people who were involved in it should be forcibly removed from their positions. However, it wasn't the whole party who did it. Not everyone who is a Republican is scum, but no one should let the people who are designated to maintain this government be allowed to behave this way.

It's a matter of priority. In the health and educational fields—both of which I have clients in—the sanctity of information and who gets to see it is paramount. Both of these fields pale in comparison to the sanctity that should be afforded our government. Yes, we (as the people who choose how we are governed) have every right to demand public knowledge of what our chosen offices are doing. The thing is, this doesn't immediately give license to those in the offices—and the people who work for them—to rifle through each other's documents in the fashion that was described in the article. These are representatives of us, and if they can't behave with the dignity that we would demand of ourselves, what does this say about ourselves as a nation?

I can easily see that being twisted into verbal images of a fascist regime taking control and stealing our liberties, but this is more a case of internal bad behavior in our government than "the man" trying to hold any of us down. That doesn't make it less serious, or make it any more acceptable, though. We just can't damn a whole group in the system because of the bad behavior of our own representatives (I realize the irony of me saying that after the title of the thread). If the Republican Party as a whole had its druthers, they would hang these guys out to dry, as a show of how they do not tolerate this type of behavior within their own ranks. Sadly, I don't see that ever happenning.


As a side note, were I someone who is in charge of decisions made around there, the guy who should have been maintaining the integrity of that server deserves to be fired. That is negligence of the highest order, and only a few steps away from leaving the information wide open to the world at large. This isn't a "whoops, there goes my bonus" kind of screw-up, this is the kind of thing that ruins any and all job security, and possibly a career. It's half-assed network admins like this who make it easy to create and spread a virus to hundreds of thousands of users with little skill or work. I get sick and tired of having to come into a place and clean up after clowns like this.

[Grey Area]

Let me just interject that I wholeheartedly agree with the sentiments of the title of this thread. :ph34r:

[Zyne]

This should read as a call for all able hackers. We need you.

[GreNME]

No way. I don't trust hackers—at least, not the guys who crack into computers—any more than I do the jerk-offs who did these dirty deeds. Besides, all but 5% of them are just moronic "click-n-run" skiddies who can't do anything but talk to begin with.

No, this is a call to bug our news stations, local papers, and even radio shows to give this "incident" a bit more exposure. Embarrass the suckers, and if it winds up costing a lot of Republican votes (and the presidency) come November, it's their own fault for allowing it. Calling people to try to crack into those systems would be akin to poking a hornet's nest with a very short stick.

Oh, and welcome to GreNME, Zyne. I don't normally get quite so political here, as this is more just a hangout for leaving messages and playing games, but I had to vent about this goofy thing after reading about it.

[Nick]

*doesn't fully support the GOP*

I would have to say I'm very liberal with some things, and conservative with others. I just don't like to let people foolishly generalize with being made out to be the fool that they are.

Not you John, I don't think you're generalizing. I realize that you're talking about a select group of people here. :)

[Zyne]

So, um, add report is NOT in fact reply....

Not trying to be political, and won't be, except to say that I would miss you if you were done with Ornery...

[Nick]

Ornery is TOO political. :P

[GreNME]

I wouldn't call it "done" with Ornery, but I'm not posting there at the moment, Zyne. I get sick real quick at people making things personal, and tired of being accused of being against a religion I happen to respect a great deal (one of the top three on my list). So, consider me sick and tired, for now. ;) The details are really a whole subject of their own.


Oh, and Nick:Not you John, I don't think you're generalizing. I realize that you're talking about a select group of people here. :)
Nope, I was generalizing here. However, it was hyperbole, I made sure to (after the first post) point out that it was hyperbole, and while I'm disgusted with the incident, I don't really hate the Republican Party. *shrug* I just used the hyperbole to grab some attention, not really to make an honest statement of how I feel. Maybe I've been reading too many newspapers. ;)

[Nick]

Nope, I was generalizing here. However, it was hyperbole, I made sure to (after the first post) point out that it was hyperbole, and while I'm disgusted with the incident, I don't really hate the Republican Party.

Ah, but see, generalization with hyperbole is usually hilariously funny, and usually gets the point across far better. :)

[Zyne]

Aye. I will make sure you know when the Pete II war ends. :rolleyes:

[GreNME]

Just like with Hatrack, not posting doesn't necessarily mean not reading. ;)

[Starla*]

John, you're only figuring this out now? Well, not all of them are bad. Just most of them.

As the extent to which Democratic communications were monitored came into sharper focus, Republicans yesterday offered a new defense. They said that in the summer of 2002, their computer technician informed his Democratic counterpart of the glitch, but Democrats did nothing to fix the problem.

I smell bullshit. I especially love the part towards the end where Miranda says its the democrats' fault for "leaving in out in the open." Yeah, because you left your bike on your porch, it's okay for me to steal it. It's your fault.

And the mention that according to some of these leaked documents, Miguel Estrada was discounted because "it's very dangerous...because he is latino."

Okay---they might have had me there---BUT FOR THE ...! I'd like to know what was in there. It might have been the entirety of "War and Peace" between statement one and statement two. It could have been printed in that manner to make the democrats appear racsist.

I'm liberal. I make no bones about it.

I've also been reading a little too much of Al Franken's "Lies and the Lying Liars who tell them." A good read. Funny. Sickening. But, well-researched, and true, though in some areas slanted.

[Zalmoxis]

<---- Zal dons the Soot Black Robe of Cynicism

Why would the media make a big deal about this?

1. They love leaked/stolen documents -- both on the level of the idea that it helps them sell papers and, I think, on a more fundamental level, that is, most journos deep down were attracted to the profession in part because of the perception of the cloak-and-dagger, semi-dangerous investigative stuff (i.e. Woodward, Bernstein, and Watergate).

2. Journalists, and they may be right about this, believe that political aides are always trying to steal the other camp's battle plans --- they love to cover the issue if it's a campaign that's high-profile enough (senate maybe, presidential, definitely), but if it's not as sexy (as in this case) then it's just business as usual and who wants to report on business as usual?

[Starla*]

Well, Zalmoxis, being a journalism student, and having been a reporter of sorts (hence my title), I have to agree with you.

I actually picked up a second major (Radio/Tv/film) because (A) journalism made me hate my own talents and (b ) I couldn't stand anybody in my major---they were cliquish (especially those who wrote for the school paper), over-dramatic, smarmy vultures who thought they were better than everyone else.

That wasn't everyone, just most. I just realized I hated newspaper writing and if I couldn't stand those in my major, how was I going to be able to stand anyone I worked with if I got into that field?

It's all very sad and very true. Those who are supposedly "objective" really aren't that objective. They really revolve around money and prestige. Not all of them, just the ones who get seen the most.